Surround sound speaker placement question

[El Penguini]

Hello -

Santa's bringing me a surround sound system to hook up to my 65" HDTV in the
room shown below. Adjust width on your screen until the room looks like a
giant cross.

This is the bonus room over my garage, and is 30x22 at the longest and
widest. The diagram gets the shape and relative dimensions fairly well.

Most of the TV watching is from the two chairs, with overflow seating on the
sofa.

i'm planning on 5.1 surround sound (that is Santa is planning on 5.1
surround sound). WHere should the two back speakers go?

Thanks for your advice

El Penguini - Patron Saint of Penguins


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[mykeymykey01@yahoo.com]

even penguins know that they should use 7.1,
make sure theres a subwoofer
position speakers centered at ear level when sitting down
spread speakers as far as possible apart
yes if the TV has built in speakers, you can use those
for center channel, it works fine.

[Bill]

"El Penguini" <ElPenguini@Comcast.net> wrote in message
news:L9OdnT6evaqHq-bYnZ2dnUVZ_hy3nZ2d@comcast.com...
> Hello -
>
> Santa's bringing me a surround sound system to hook up to my 65"
> HDTV in the
> room shown below. Adjust width on your screen until the room looks
> like a
> giant cross.
>
> This is the bonus room over my garage, and is 30x22 at the longest
> and
> widest. The diagram gets the shape and relative dimensions fairly
> well.

Actually, the diagram looks really odd at this end and I'm not sure
how it's supposed to look.

> i'm planning on 5.1 surround sound (that is Santa is planning on 5.1
> surround sound). WHere should the two back speakers go?

Try the official Dolby website for setup options:

http://www.dolby.com/consumer/home_entertainment/roomlayout.html

Click on the tags below the image to see different layouts.

--
Happy Holidays!

[Kalman Rubinson]

On 9 Dec 2006 17:33:30 -0800, mykeymykey01@yahoo.com wrote:

>even penguins know that they should use 7.1,
Depends on how far the listening position is from the rear wall.

>make sure theres a subwoofer
Yup.

>position speakers centered at ear level when sitting down
Yup

>spread speakers as far as possible apart
Nope. See the ITU or Dolby recommendations linked on another reply.

>yes if the TV has built in speakers, you can use those
>for center channel, it works fine.
TV speakers sound like crap. Use only if you are deaf.

Kal

[mykeymykey01@yahoo.com]

Kalman Rubinson wrote:
> On 9 Dec 2006 17:33:30 -0800, mykeymykey01@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> >even penguins know that they should use 7.1,
> Depends on how far the listening position is from the rear wall.

7.1 is superior sound in every way. If you can afford it, do it.
>
> >make sure theres a subwoofer
> Yup.

I would buy a self powered sub with 12-15" cone because these
little "shoebox" subwoofers sound like crap compared to a real one.
>
> >position speakers centered at ear level when sitting down
> Yup
>
> >spread speakers as far as possible apart
> Nope. See the ITU or Dolby recommendations linked on another reply.

I still recommend far as possible to get a wider field. Dolby really
has poor sound quality and recommend you look at THX instead.
Also consider Lexicon surround unit instead of typical consumer
grade surround unit.
>
> >yes if the TV has built in speakers, you can use those
> >for center channel, it works fine.
> TV speakers sound like crap. Use only if you are deaf.
>
On many of these new TVs a Y cord can be used to the stereo audio
input to make a mono center channel and it works just as well or
better than the typical center channel speaker. If you have a larger
budget and can afford an expensive center channel speaker, thats fine
too.
I'm really amazed at the crappy quality center channel speakers being
sold today.

[Kalman Rubinson]

On 10 Dec 2006 08:54:54 -0800, mykeymykey01@yahoo.com wrote:

>
>Kalman Rubinson wrote:
>> On 9 Dec 2006 17:33:30 -0800, mykeymykey01@yahoo.com wrote:
>>
>> >even penguins know that they should use 7.1,
>> Depends on how far the listening position is from the rear wall.
>
>7.1 is superior sound in every way. If you can afford it, do it.
Sure but not if your couch/chair is against the rear wall. Won't work
that way.
>
>> Nope. See the ITU or Dolby recommendations linked on another reply.
>
>I still recommend far as possible to get a wider field.
That can be carried to extreme too easily and misleads the beginners
who tend to shove the speakers into the corners anyway.
>
> Dolby really has poor sound quality and recommend you look at THX instead.
The two are not independant.
>
>On many of these new TVs a Y cord can be used to the stereo audio
>input to make a mono center channel and it works just as well or
>better than the typical center channel speaker. If you have a larger
>budget and can afford an expensive center channel speaker, thats fine
>too.
Almost ANY component speaker will be superior to the TV's built-in
speakers.
>I'm really amazed at the crappy quality center channel speakers being
>sold today.
Yeah but most are still better than the TV speakers and, in addition,
will almost always mismatch in tonal balance with the separate L/R
speakers.

Kal

[Rich Clark]

<mykeymykey01@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1165769694.237405.185790@16g2000cwy.googlegro ups.com...
>
> Kalman Rubinson wrote:
>> On 9 Dec 2006 17:33:30 -0800, mykeymykey01@yahoo.com wrote:
>>
>> >even penguins know that they should use 7.1,
>> Depends on how far the listening position is from the rear wall.
>
> 7.1 is superior sound in every way. If you can afford it, do it.

Depends on the size of the room and the speaker types. In a smaller space
with surround speakers that create a lot of diffusion, the additional fill
of one or two additional surround speakers is often completely inaudible.
>
> I still recommend far as possible to get a wider field. Dolby really
> has poor sound quality and recommend you look at THX instead.

Dolby is an encoding/method. THX is a hardware certification process. Omong
the thing THX certifies is equipment with Dolby decoders. There is no
"instead."

> On many of these new TVs a Y cord can be used to the stereo audio
> input to make a mono center channel and it works just as well or
> better than the typical center channel speaker. If you have a larger
> budget and can afford an expensive center channel speaker, thats fine
> too.
> I'm really amazed at the crappy quality center channel speakers being
> sold today.

Even if you have one of the rare TV's with speakers that approach the
quality of the most ordinary sub-$100 center, it will have vastly different
tonal balance from your L/R mains. Having a grossly mismatched center
speaker is worse than having no center speaker at all. Better to run in
"phantom center" mode; at least then there will be none of the horrible
audible artifacts you get from having a center that sounds like a lemon in a
system where the mains sound like oranges.

RichC

[RicSeyler]

mykeymykey01@yahoo.com wrote:

>even penguins know that they should use 7.1,
>make sure theres a subwoofer
>position speakers centered at ear level when sitting down
>spread speakers as far as possible apart
>yes if the
>

>TV has built in speakers, you can use those
>for center channel, it works fine.
>
>
>
Ugggh.......... Timbre and voice matching with the rest of the system
will be terrible! Killing the holosonic soundfield.
Not to mention most TV speakers are terrible to begin with........

--
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[El Penguini]

thanks to all for the information.

I'm a complete newb, so your details are great to get me thinking right.

The seating diagram is the issue. The room is essentially "+" shaped, with
the tv in at the bottom of the + and the seating in one wing of the +. and
the seating is against the wall.

the "standard placement instruction" links on the web don't advise in these
conditions.

Any specific thoughts on this problem?

"Bill" <bill@c.a> wrote in message
news:xN2dnYjYVt_f9ebYnZ2dnUVZ_rWnnZ2d@golden.net.. .
> "El Penguini" <ElPenguini@Comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:L9OdnT6evaqHq-bYnZ2dnUVZ_hy3nZ2d@comcast.com...
>> Hello -
>>
>> Santa's bringing me a surround sound system to hook up to my 65" HDTV in
>> the
>> room shown below. Adjust width on your screen until the room looks like
>> a
>> giant cross.
>>
>> This is the bonus room over my garage, and is 30x22 at the longest and
>> widest. The diagram gets the shape and relative dimensions fairly well.
>
> Actually, the diagram looks really odd at this end and I'm not sure how
> it's supposed to look.
>
>> i'm planning on 5.1 surround sound (that is Santa is planning on 5.1
>> surround sound). WHere should the two back speakers go?
>
> Try the official Dolby website for setup options:
>
> http://www.dolby.com/consumer/home_entertainment/roomlayout.html
>
> Click on the tags below the image to see different layouts.
>
> --
> Happy Holidays!
>

[Bill]

"El Penguini" <ElPenguini@Comcast.net> wrote in message
news:xb2dnfjKy9AcbR7YnZ2dnUVZ_q-vnZ2d@comcast.com...
> thanks to all for the information.
>
> I'm a complete newb, so your details are great to get me thinking
> right.
>
> The seating diagram is the issue. The room is essentially "+"
> shaped, with the tv in at the bottom of the + and the seating in one
> wing of the +. and the seating is against the wall.
>
> the "standard placement instruction" links on the web don't advise
> in these conditions.

While the standard room is not the same shape, the positioning of the
speakers relative to the viewers should still be the same. Look at the
link I gave you and think about where your couch is located and how
you can get speakers positioned around that area.

If you expect to put speakers in the room so every seating area can
enjoy the sound, it simply won't happen. The speakers are placed
around the listeners in such a way that it creates an envelope of
surround sound. If the speakers are not in the correct locations, you
won't get a proper 360' circle of sound, it's as simple as that. And
even though you place the speakers around the viewers, you still need
to volume match the speakers so left/right and front/rear sound pans
move smoothly around the room.

If you don't care about the soundfield, then put the speakers anywhere
you want to fill the room with sound. Just don't expect it to sound
anything like a home theater.

By the way, most people who want a home theater are willing to arrange
the room to get the best experience possible. A room with a TV and
speakers is not a home theater, it's just another room.

A home theater is a viewing area where you can enjoy the full
experience of a surround sound movie. Often the main living room is
the same place, but you have to make some living space changes to
accommodate the home theater. Sometimes wives don't like it, but once
they enjoy a movie with the full immersive experience, they usually
relent and let you keep the home theater.

This is part of the WAF or wife acceptance factor.

:-)

--
Happy Holidays!